--- Log opened Mon Mar 03 00:00:00 2008
00:02 < factor> would be cool if synaptic installer had icons for each package , would take up a lot more space but would be cool
00:03 < Yoyobuae> how about this: keyframes own a set of waypoints, duplicating the keyframe simply duplicates the child waypoints
00:04 < factor> I only seen rores pic on the loading not the about box
00:04 < factor> cool though
00:05 < factor> like the help selection though
00:06 < factor> the text is using a color I cant see for "synfig studio"
00:07 < genete> Yoyobuae: that means that everytime you create a keyframe you need to add waypoints to everything that want to keep when duplicate.
00:08 < genete> and remember that a keyframe is valid for all the layers so each layer can have some waypoints there (or not)
00:08 < Yoyobuae> genete: exactly.  you can select what gets duplicated =)
00:09 < genete> cool, but how? in a particular frame there can be a bunch of waypoints from several different layers/parameters
00:10 < genete> how can you make a collection with all of them?
00:10 < genete> or "some" of them?
00:10 < Yoyobuae> first create keyframe, select it, connect waypoint to it XD
00:10 < Yoyobuae> or create the keyframe, then select it, all the waypoints default to being childs of that keyframe
00:11 < genete> but how do you define what waypoints connect and what not?
00:11 < genete> s/what/which
00:12 < Yoyobuae> by creating or selecting the keyframe before creating the waypoints
00:12 < Yoyobuae> unselecting, if you want the waypoint to be a lonewolr
00:13 < Yoyobuae> s/lonewolr/lonewolf/
00:14 < dooglus> Yoyobuae: why do you need to scale the tangents in your nose demo?
00:15 < Yoyobuae> dooglus: when a bezier is split in two, the tangents need to be scaled. shorter bezier = shorter tangents
00:16 < Yoyobuae> dooglus: actually it should be done like this: http://www.cs.mtu.edu/~shene/COURSES/cs3621/NOTES/spline/Bezier/bezier-sub.html
00:17 < Yoyobuae> i made a sif file using that exact method, but then noticed that scaling the tangents from "Bline tangent" convert also works
00:19 < genete> dooglus: you will kill me. :(
00:20 < Yoyobuae> dooglus: that site has lot info about beziers, you can look at the index too: http://www.cs.mtu.edu/~shene/COURSES/cs3621/NOTES/spline/Bezier/
00:20 < Yoyobuae> genete: what did you do now? =)
00:20 < genete> discover several bugs :)
00:21 < genete> feather parameter is buggy
00:22 < genete> try a negative feather value in a circle ;)
00:22 < genete> or try to pick the alpha value of a feather in a region using the eyedrop ;)
00:23 < Yoyobuae> eyedrop doesn't work for some layers
00:24 < Yoyobuae> its a rendering issue, most layers are written to render fully into the canvas.
00:25 < Yoyobuae> the eyedrop needs only one pixel, something most layers aren't programmed to do
00:25 < Yoyobuae> s/most/some/
00:26 < genete> yes it works fine for circles though
00:28 < Yoyobuae> dooglus: oh almost forgot, if you put a tangent convert in a tangent of a bline, it's too short.  half as short, so i scale it by 2.
00:28 < Yoyobuae> at some point synfig will need a rewrite of the rendering code, i think
00:29 < genete> ok, I will test it tomorrow and make a bug traker for it. Bedtime now
00:29 < Yoyobuae> g'night
00:29 < genete> Yoyobuae: yep more coders are needed ;)
00:29 < genete> G.N.
00:29  * genete is away: Estoy ocupado
00:29  * genete is back (gone 00:00:03)
00:29 -!- genete [n=Genete@84.122.52.28.dyn.user.ono.com] has quit ["Abandonando"]
00:44 < htodd> arrgh
00:47 < htodd> about.cpp:126: error: 'set_wrap_license' was not declared in this scope
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01:54 < factor> once you download it to that directory
01:54 < factor> dho sorry wrong tab in xchat
01:54 < factor> :D
04:40 < pixelgeek> 'Allo, 'allo, this is Nighthawk, are you receiving me? Over.
04:41 < htodd> did you get it to build?
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05:22 < pixelgeek> Yes.  I don't know why you would get an error in the about dialog.  
05:23 < pixelgeek> I mean, I know its changed recently, but I don't know why it worked for me and not for you.
05:45 < pabs3> htodd: which version of gtkmm?
05:46 < htodd> 2.4
05:46 < pabs3> 2.4? I have 2.12 here
05:47 < pabs3> looks like it was added in 2.8: http://www.gtkmm.org/docs/gtkmm-2.4/docs/reference/html/classGtk_1_1AboutDialog.html#d05699f5a01a4084f06a07aeaefcc0a1
05:48 < htodd> hmm
05:48 < pabs3> we'll need to add a check for it like the other one
05:49 < htodd> nm, it's 2.6.14
05:49 < htodd> so fairly old
05:49 < htodd> gtkmm2.4-2.6.14-1002
05:49 < htodd> packaging systems and their fun versioning
05:51 < pabs3> ok, so everything 2.8 and above we need to check for
05:51 < pabs3> I'll whip up a patch
05:51 < htodd> thanks
05:54 < pixelgeek> Those fancy Linux users with their updated GTK packages.... ;)
05:55 < pixelgeek> Windows packages are uploaded on Sourceforge, Windows Download page updated to reflect that.  
05:55  * pixelgeek going to skip beverage of choice in favour of sleep.
05:55 < factor> k
05:55 < factor> almost z time here
05:56 < pixelgeek> Almost?  You're 2 hours ahead of me, aren't you?
05:57 < factor> 11 here
05:58 < factor> trying to figure out zope web page routing, have to re learn it every time.
05:58 < pabs3> dooglus: don't do any commits yet, I forgot to do the tagging/branching
05:58 < factor> apache2 rewrite
06:00 < pabs3> htodd: you'll need to run autoreconf after applying it: http://bonedaddy.net/pabs3/files/tmp/old-gtkmm.patch
06:01 < pixelgeek> scary - nearly twice as many downloads of synfig studio as synfig for Windows ....
06:04 < pabs3> pixelgeek: does studio check if you have synfig installed before installing?
06:04 < pixelgeek> No.  It checks if you have studio though.
06:05 < pixelgeek> On the list of things to do in my sabbatical - an all-in-one installer.  I can't imagine any windows user is going to want to just render existing files from the command line.
06:05 < pabs3> studio check if you have studio??
06:05 < pixelgeek> It prompts if you want to uninstall a previous version
06:05 < pabs3> like it checks for an older version of studio?
06:05 < pabs3> ah
06:06  * pixelgeek must do a screen cap of the whole install process under windows for newbies
06:08 < pixelgeek> OK - Install from sourceforge worked - I think Windows is good to go. 
06:08 < pabs3> sweet
06:08 < pixelgeek> 'night all...
06:08 < pabs3> I'll update the download page
06:08 < pixelgeek> done!
06:09 < pabs3> cool, thanks
06:09 < pixelgeek> well, the one on the wiki anyway.  I haven't touched the one on the old .com site
06:10 < pabs3> ya, leave that one
06:11 < factor> yeah got the web page routing finished
06:11 < factor> missed the whole day messing with synfig now :(
06:13 < htodd> all I ever do is get it to compile with fink and no one ever uses it
06:14 < pabs3> htodd: does fink not do something like popcon.debian.org?
06:16 < CIA-35> synfig: pabs * r1840 /ETL/tags/stable: Stable Tag: Removing old tag
06:16 < CIA-35> synfig: pabs * r1841 /ETL/tags/stable: Stable Tag: Copying everything over
06:16 < CIA-35> synfig: pabs * r1842 /ETL/tags/0.61.06: Release 0.61.08
06:16 < CIA-35> synfig: pabs * r1843 /synfig-core/tags/stable: Stable Tag: Removing old tag
06:16 < CIA-35> synfig: pabs * r1844 /ETL/tags/0.61.06: Release: Removing incorrect tag
06:19 < htodd> that patch worked fine
06:19 < htodd> not that I ever do anything beyond compile
06:21 < pabs3> cool
06:23 < htodd> ok, committed
06:24 < htodd> actually got synfigstudio to run the pirates.sifz
06:31 < CIA-35> synfig: pabs * r1845 /ETL/tags/0.4.11: Release 0.4.11
06:31 < CIA-35> synfig: pabs * r1846 /synfig-core/tags/stable: Stable Tag: Copying everything over
06:31 < CIA-35> synfig: pabs * r1847 /synfig-core/tags/0.61.08: Release 0.61.08
06:31 < CIA-35> synfig: pabs * r1848 /synfig-studio/tags/stable: Stable Tag: Removing old tag
06:31 < CIA-35> synfig: pabs * r1849 /synfig-studio/tags/stable: Stable Tag: Copying everything over
06:31 < CIA-35> synfig: pabs * r1850 /synfig-studio/tags/0.61.08: Release 0.61.08
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07:20 < pabs3> do people think we should remove the "developer preview" comment on the front page?
07:28 -!- pabs3 changed the topic of #synfig to: http://synfig.org/FAQ | synfig 0.61.08 now available from http://synfig.org/Download | http://synfig.org/forums/viewtopic.php?p=232#232 rore wins February Challenge! | news: http://synfig.org/News/2008-01-02 http://synfig.org/News/Draft | Ask your question and wait - we will answer it eventually!
08:05 < pabs3> what do people think of adding the splash screen for each release to the releases pages?
08:30 < pabs3> ah, crap, mediawiki security update
08:38 < pabs3> ah, only a bugfix for our version. easy patch
08:45 < pabs3> http://blog.josefsson.org/2008/02/27/real-world-performance-tuning-with-callgrind/
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11:02 < Zelgadis> 0.61.08 release! congratulations!
--- Log closed Mon Mar 03 11:08:27 2008
--- Log opened Mon Mar 03 11:09:48 2008
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11:32 < CIA-35> synfig: pabs * r1851 /synfig-studio/trunk/ (src/gtkmm/about.cpp configure.ac): Check for Gtk::AboutDialog::set_wrap_license, which was added in Gtkmm 2.8. Allows synfigstudio to build on the fink distribution.
12:56 < AkhIL> > The Second Open Video Developers Meeting will take place on the 6th of March on the #openvideo IRC channel at the freenode IRC network, the time is: 21:00GMT
12:59 < pabs3> thanks AkhIL 
13:00 < factor> missed the last one
13:00 < factor> see if I can catch some of this one
13:00 < factor> need to have a web site of just these types of meetings
13:00 < factor> ok back to sleep
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15:18 < pabs3> hmm, need a volunteer to change the images on the main page(s) once a week
15:20 < pabs3> venus eye trap is cool
15:25 < Zelgadis> Yoyobuae: The main thing I got from your example is: if you want attach one vertex to bline you can attach it not only to this bline's vertex
15:26 < Zelgadis> Yoyobuae: This can dramatically reduce count of used vertices
15:28 < Zelgadis> Yoyobuae: less vertices -> animation is more simply
15:30  * Zelgadis used Yoyobuae's tehnique to attach eyelashes to eye
15:36 < dooglus_> Zelgadis: I used a similar technique here: http://dooglus.rincevent.net/random/bezier.sifz
15:36 < rore> pabs3: images on the main page? The pirates and the Prologue images? 
15:37 < pabs3> rore: yeah, and the community section of the gallery page
15:40 < rore> I must say that I would prefer to see the pirate image stay on the 1st page forever, that's the most impressive still I saw, so far :)
15:41 < pabs3> :)
15:41 < pabs3> what about a row of images below?
15:41 < rore> yep, that solution would be better
15:42  * rore thought about re-doing the mediawiki style, to make it look more like a "normal" site, with wiki 
15:43 < pabs3> sounds good, the tango website is also mediawiki, so you could use their theme as docs on how to do it
15:43 < pabs3> theres an item about that on the wiki wishlist page
15:48 < rore> (I'll have to customise a mediawiki soon, so I guess I'll gain experience :)) 
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15:50 < pabs3> ah, cool :)
15:51 < Yoyobuae> Zelgadis: what i had in mind was to move around the attach points of blines as the shape is animated
15:53 < Yoyobuae> then it's easier to make shapes curvier or flatter as needed in, for example, a knee or elbow
15:55 < Zelgadis> oh, so you intended also to change Amount during animation?
16:00 < Zelgadis> dooglus_: yeah, I see now
16:01 < Zelgadis> It could be useful to have ability to do such attachments simply with mouse
16:01 < Yoyobuae> Zelgadis: true =)
16:02 < Yoyobuae> maybe even drag the point of attachment along the bline XD
16:03 < Zelgadis> yeah, changing the amount respectively
16:03 < Yoyobuae> another one which would be very useful is a cutting tool. which splits blines/regions in parts
16:05 < Zelgadis> I think I could make a proposal on wiki for "splice tehnique"
16:05 < Zelgadis> I have some ideas about that
16:05 < Zelgadis> but not now
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16:06  * Zelgadis busy filling report about "lock keyframes" bug
16:06 < Zelgadis> split blines maybe in such way: right click on vertex and choose "Split" from context menu :)
16:07 < Zelgadis> (jus a proposal)
16:07 < Zelgadis> (just a proposal)
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16:26 < Yoyobuae> Zelgadis: actually, "Insert Item (Smart)" can already insert a vertex in a bline where you right click
16:27 < Yoyobuae> i don't know why it doesn't scale the tangents to keep the curve shape the same though
16:27 < Zelgadis> Yoyobuae: you mean if I want to connect vertex of one Bline to some segment of another bline?
16:28 < Zelgadis> Yoyobuae: This produces unneeded points
16:29 < Zelgadis> Yoyobuae: Imagine, I want to connect 3 eyelashes to eye
16:29 < Yoyobuae> ok
16:29 < Zelgadis> Then I need set 3 more vertex on eye outline
16:30 < genete> hi. I agree with Zelgadis :)
16:30 < Zelgadis> But with splice tehnique I getting more smooth result with less vertices ^-^
16:30 < genete> but we should need a better interface for that
16:30 < genete> not that convert -> export etc thing
16:30 < genete> something more intuitive for the end user
16:31 < Zelgadis> I think about "temporary vertex"
16:32 < Zelgadis> genete: "temporary vertex" is a pseudo-vertex, what we could move along the bline
16:32 < genete> that's what end user needs. Something to be used with the mouse =)
16:32 < Zelgadis> genete: yeah
16:33 < genete> but it implies reverse calculation
16:33 < Zelgadis> genete: what do you mean?
16:33 < genete> I mean find the closest point fo the bline that matches the mouse position
16:33 < Yoyobuae> that is already done
16:33 < Yoyobuae> its how curved gradient works in fact
16:33 < genete> when you move the mouse you probably get the duck outside the bline
16:34 < Yoyobuae> a curve gradient finds the closest point in the bline to EACH PIXEL, and uses the distance along the bline to cycle thru the gradient's colors
16:34 < genete> and then the computer should decide where you intended to put the duck (what position of the bline you want)
16:35 < Zelgadis> genete: when you move the mouse you actually changing just the Amount value. So mouse not needed to coincide with vertex while moving
16:36 < genete> that's what I say: current Yoyobuae example uses a real duck to represent the Amount of the curve. I would like it more graphical
16:36 < genete> I don't know where 6,43 would lie in the curve
16:37 < Yoyobuae> on the end =)
16:37 < genete> but I know where I want the duck to be...
16:37 < genete> not if looped =)
16:37 < Yoyobuae> true
16:38 < Yoyobuae> its simple enough to draw a duck on the bline, even allow it to be dragged.
16:38 < Yoyobuae> although it would be easier if the duck could be dragged everywhere, but it snaps back to the bline once you release the mouse button
16:39 < genete> For example: the angle duck doesn't matter what radious you get with the duck. It only looks for the angle value. It would be similar. Drag the duck and only look the Amount paramter based on some rules (minimum perp distance)
16:39 < genete> yeah!
16:39  * pabspabspabs sends 3 pabspabspabs at pabs3
16:39 < Yoyobuae> on question: when should that duck be shown?
16:39 < genete> Yoyobuae: you read m,y mind ;)
16:39 < Zelgadis> Yoyobuae: genete: Alt+6
16:39 < Zelgadis> ;)
16:40 < Zelgadis> Alt+6 shows all temporary ducks
16:40 < Yoyobuae> i mean that the ducks shown usually belong to the current layer
16:40 < Zelgadis> and then you may link any vertex of other bline to temporary vertex
16:41 < genete> Zelgadis: how many temporary vertex can a bline have?
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16:42 < Zelgadis> Each bline layer could have one unlinked temporary vertex, but as many already linked as you like
16:42 < Zelgadis> because temporary vertex are not exist really
16:42 < Zelgadis> They just needed to link some vertex to particular position of bline
16:43 < Zelgadis> or for changing that position
16:43 < Yoyobuae> how about this: you create a temporary duck.  ducks do not belong to layers. they are managed by duckmatic (that name makes me crazy XD )
16:43 < genete> Why don't just let the converted types to be manipulated in an inversed way?
16:43 < Zelgadis> genete: how?
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16:44 < genete> current converted ducks (vertices or what ever) gets greyed, right?
16:44 < genete> it means that it is not possible to change its values by using the duckmatic routines 
16:44 < genete> for example a=c*d
16:45 < genete> where c is a constant paramter 
16:45 < Zelgadis> Yoyobuae: if we need to link ducks from 2 different blines then we choosing 2 layers. How we decide which layer temporary vertex belongs to?
16:45 < genete> if I have a visual representation of "a" I can modify "d" by the duck of "a"
16:46 < genete> just using the inverse fucntion (d=a/c)
16:46 < Zelgadis> genete: you right that's needed to
16:46 < Zelgadis> manipulate
16:46 < Yoyobuae> Zelgadis: neither duck belongs to neither bline, but they do hold a reference into their respective blines =)
16:46 < genete> I think that it is the solution to a lof of requests
16:46 < genete> inverse manipulation
16:47 < Zelgadis> genete: but we need an easy way to link vertex to any part of outline
16:47 < Yoyobuae> each convert manipulationg will need to be coded
16:47 < Zelgadis> There are two problems: linking with mouse and manipulation with mouse
16:47 < genete> Zelgadis: convert a vertice to a Bline vertex and allow that converted one to be manipulated. Let synfig compute the inverse fucntion
16:48 < genete> Zelgadis: the linking is not aproblem
16:48 < genete> just link and place it at Amount = 0,5
16:48 < genete> then you place it with the mouse where you want
16:48 < Zelgadis> genete: It's not visual :)
16:49 < genete> no I mean let's make Amount = 0.5 after convert
16:49 < genete> then you drag the duck at the end or start or what ever visual position of the bline
16:49 < Zelgadis> I want link them just as I linking vertices of differend blines :)
16:50 < genete> Zelgadis: let's fight the problems in small steps
16:50 < Zelgadis> genete: ok
16:50  * Zelgadis preparing his spells
16:50 < genete> If we can reverse manipulate some special ducks tha's a BIG step =)
16:51 < Zelgadis> as dooglus_ mentioned some convert types already reverse manipulated
16:51 < genete> yes, the symple ones ;)
16:51 < genete> simple   ^
16:52 < Zelgadis> so theoretically it's possible
16:52 < Yoyobuae> suggestion: to place a circle on a bline:
16:52 < Yoyobuae> 1) Select the center duck of the circle
16:52 < Yoyobuae> 2) Right click on the bline
16:52 < Yoyobuae> 3) Link
16:52 < Yoyobuae> the circle's center gets converted to a "Bline vertex", its "Bline" parameter linked and its amount set to match the mouse position as closely as possible
16:52 < pabs3> nite all
16:53 < genete> night pabs3, good job, rest well :)
16:53 < Zelgadis> Yoyobuae: we cant freely change position of circle then
16:53 < Zelgadis> *can't
16:53 < Yoyobuae> yes, you can simply drag its center
16:53 < Yoyobuae> its snaps back to the bline, at the closest point
16:54 < Zelgadis> What if I want not place circle on a bline, but just link circle center with bline vertex?
16:54 < Yoyobuae> the "Bline vertex" will need special duck code to reverse manipulate it though
16:55 < Yoyobuae> Zelgadis: that already possible, simply select both, the center and bline vertex then right click and select "Link"
16:55 < genete> Yoyobuae: yes that's possible and desirable. But I suggest to make small steps. First try to allow inverse manipulation.
16:56 < genete> if it works then automatize the tasks would be "easy"
16:56 < genete> (taking account that we should convince dooglus to do that)
16:57 < genete> ;)
16:57 < Yoyobuae> i've had some experience wrangling ducks =)
16:57 < Zelgadis> Yoyobuae: can't understand. What's the difference in algorythms of "place circle on the bline" and "link bline center to bline vertex"
16:57 < Zelgadis> ?
16:58 < Yoyobuae> linking the center to a vertex wouldn't allow moving along the bline
16:58 < Zelgadis> genete: I think we should write proposal on wiki, containing main ideas. dooglus_ already have enough work 
16:59 < Zelgadis> Yoyobuae: what's the difference in _algorythms_
16:59 < Zelgadis> ?
16:59 < Zelgadis> In both cases you selecting the center of circle and vertex and choosing "Link"
16:59 < genete> Zelgadis: yes, right.
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17:00 < Yoyobuae> Zelgadis: actually right clicking the bline is not the same as right clicking a vertex of it =)
17:00 < genete> Zelgadis: yes, the context menu is completely different.
17:00 < Yoyobuae> its possible to right click anywhere on the bline
17:00 < Zelgadis> Yoyobuae: Now I see! "Right click _on_the_bline_"
17:00 < Zelgadis> missed that
17:01 < Zelgadis> Yoyobuae: Now I like your algoryhtm
17:01 < Yoyobuae> =)
17:02 < Zelgadis> Could someone make proposal on wiki based on our conversation?
17:04 < genete> I'll make a draft :)
17:04 < genete> How should I call it?
17:04 < Zelgadis> Thank you, genete
17:05 < Zelgadis> "Visual slice tehnique proposal"?
17:06 < genete> "Manipulate converted ducks"
17:06 < Yoyobuae> Linking stuff to blines with mouse XD
17:06 < genete> and the slice thing is one of the benefits
17:06 < Zelgadis> "Linking to Blines with mouse"
17:06 < genete> because ther can be more benefits hidden =)
17:07 < Zelgadis> yeah, following a bline for example ^-^
17:07 < Yoyobuae> there's two parts actually: a new action on the bline's context menu and the manipulation of "Bline vertex" with the mouse
17:07 < Zelgadis> yeah, two chapters :)
17:08 < Yoyobuae> err, what about "Bline tangent" ?
17:08 < genete> OK, let's make a draft one and add or remove what you need
17:08 < Yoyobuae> genete: ok
17:08 < genete> it can have several chapters
17:09 < Zelgadis> Yoyobuae: hmmm. That's why I suggesting "temporary vertex"
17:09 < genete> but the main page would be something like "Yoyogaldisnete feature requests"
17:09 < Yoyobuae> let's say you make a "Follow the bline" like example.  Should both, the bline vertex and bline tangent be editable?
17:10 < Yoyobuae> genete: lol
17:10 < Zelgadis> genete: bwa-hA-HA-HA-HAHAH-AH-AH-ah :)
17:10 < genete> ;)
17:10 < Zelgadis> Yoyobuae: yes
17:11 < Zelgadis> Yoyogaldisnete = Roadmap :)
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17:11 < Yoyobuae> Zelgadis: what im worried about is that those two converts might not even be in the same layer XD
17:12  * Zelgadis writing suggestion2
17:12 < Yoyobuae> i'm thinking being able to create ducks which are not tied to any layer would be good
17:13 < Yoyobuae> the user can then create all the ducks that are necesary to manipulate things easier
17:13 < Yoyobuae> sort of customizing the interface used to manipulate things. hmm, interesting =)
17:14 < genete> Zelgadis: are you editing a new page? I'm editing a new one  too 
17:14 < Zelgadis> genete: no
17:14 < genete> ok
17:15 < Zelgadis> suggestion2: to place  a circle on a bline:
17:15 < Zelgadis> 1) User selecting both layers: circle and bline
17:15 < Zelgadis> 2) User displays "temporary vertex" (Alt+6 ?)
17:15 < Zelgadis> 3) User can move "temporary vertex" across bline as he likes. "temporary vertex" have vertex duck, width duck and tangent ducks, which are changing according to position on a bline
17:15 < Zelgadis> 4) user selecting vaertex duck of "temporary vertex" and center of circle
17:15 < Zelgadis> 5) right-click -> Link
17:18 < Zelgadis> As "temporary vertex" have tangents ducks, we could link tangents of other bline vertex to them similary.
17:19 < Zelgadis> genete: remember your talk with dooglus_ yesterday?
17:19 < genete> Yoyobuae: can you re-post the link to your nose example?
17:19 < Zelgadis> genete: about keyframes
17:20 < genete> yes, (more or less)
17:21 < Zelgadis> genete: 23:40 < genete> use the interpolation method of the waypoints of the old keyframe must be mandatory
17:21 < Zelgadis> 23:40 < genete> if they exists
17:21 < Zelgadis> genete: I agree
17:21 < genete> Zelgadis: thanks :)
17:23 < Yoyobuae> http://members.lycos.co.uk/yoyobuae/bline_attached_2sections.sifz
17:23 < genete> Yoyobuae: thanks
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17:33 < Zelgadis> Submited a summary of discussion keyframes lock bug: Lock keyframes not preserves all keyframes (http://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=1906375&group_id=144022&atid=757416)
17:35 < Zelgadis> Yoyobuae: what do you think about suggestion2?
17:40 < Yoyobuae> Zelgadis: it would work pretty well
17:41 < Yoyobuae> i would preffer to simply add a couple of entries to the context menu, seems simpler
17:42 < genete> Both: http://synfig.org/Inverse_Duck_Manipulation
17:42 < genete> I'm sorry for the title :)
17:42 < Zelgadis> Yoyobuae: i.e. "Link with tangents"?
17:43 < Yoyobuae> Zelgadis: the context menu would link real values to the bline width, and vectors to either bline vertex or tangent
17:43 < Yoyobuae> which would need 2 entries in the case of linking a vector to a bline XD . but maybe that's not too bad
17:43 < Zelgadis> Yoyobuae: but at which place?
17:44 < Yoyobuae> where the user right clicks
17:44 < Zelgadis> but if we move linked vertex, it's tangent won't change
17:45 < Zelgadis> maybe: select tangent and vertex ducks -> right click on bline -> link
17:46 < Zelgadis> That's link tangent and vertex to the same position on Bline
17:46 < Yoyobuae> remember there is only one thing with vertexes and tangents: blines
17:46 < Zelgadis> and?
17:46 < Yoyobuae> but what about when a random shape, which the user puts a rotate layer on top =)
17:47 < Zelgadis> then we'll have the same effect as linking one vertex to another with layers having different transformations
17:48 < Yoyobuae> true XD
17:48 < Zelgadis> but that's another case
17:48 < Zelgadis> and another probem
17:48 < Zelgadis> *problem
17:48 < Zelgadis> different problem
17:48 < genete> hey guys!
17:49 < factor> lo
17:50 < genete> you both have very intelligent brains but let's use them over small steps each time!. Baby steps guys, babe steps....
17:50 < Zelgadis> to make proper steps we need to define target ;)
17:50 < genete> he he
17:51 < Zelgadis> and direction
17:53 < Zelgadis> Yoyobuae: what do you think about selecting both tangentand vertex ducks to link them to the bline position with same amount?
17:54 < genete> please update and/or modify http://synfig.org/Inverse_Duck_Manipulation
17:54 < Zelgadis> I'll do it
17:54  * Zelgadis casts spell of teleportation
17:54 < Zelgadis> "To the wiki!"
18:26 < factor> So the sound layer isd almost donre
18:26 < factor> done
18:26 < factor> :)
18:27  * Zelgadis teleporting himself back
18:27 < Zelgadis> genete: Yoyobuae: take a look
18:28 < genete> factor: almost done? where?
18:32 < genete> eeeh! "If was more than one dick selected for linking" that typo must be fixed!!!! ;)
18:33 < Yoyobuae> genete: already done XD
18:33 < Zelgadis> my english... ~^_^~
18:34 < genete> he he
18:34 < factor> heh
18:34 < genete> "u" and "i" are so close...
18:34 < genete> in the keyboard
18:34 < factor> even closer on cell phone
18:34 < Zelgadis>  ~^_^~  ~^_^~  ~^_^~
18:35 < genete> the page looks fine. Let's waut dooglus opinion and we will see.
18:35 < genete> wait ^
18:36 < Zelgadis> hentai on proposal page - bad sign ^_^"
18:36 < genete> or do you feel strong today Yoyobuae ??
18:36 < Yoyobuae> Zelgadis: lol
18:36 < Yoyobuae> genete: i could give it a try =)
18:41 < Zelgadis> night all
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18:41 < factor> k
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18:43 < genete> factor: what about the Sound layer?
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18:57 < factor> hetre
18:58 < factor> was just making a funny
18:58 < factor> that would bre a lot of work
18:58 < genete> ;,-(
18:58 < factor> but would be a cool feature
18:58 < genete> hi dooglus
18:59 < factor> unless someone is working on it
18:59 < factor> not i
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19:01 < factor> i wasd wanting to get some thing like a headless render interface
19:01 < factor> thouigh was side trackedf thisd week because i said i would set a page for someone
19:01 < Headbang> worth while to try out svn?
19:02 < factor> has nice splash screen
19:02 < Headbang> lol
19:02 < Headbang> just saw the voting outcome :)
19:03 < genete> Headbang: the svn is quite similar to the last release
19:03 < Headbang> ok :)
19:03 < Headbang> ill give it a go tonight
19:03 < genete> and if you're under windows a executable woud be out in a few days
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19:03 < Headbang> i am atm
19:04 < Headbang> going to pick up a monitor to instlll my own linux machine again 
19:04 < genete> and also some other installable binaries for other OS (linux)
19:04 < dooglus_> I think svn is the same as the new release at the moment
19:04 < dooglus_> hi genete, hi all
19:04 < Headbang> mm i like svn :)
19:04 < Headbang> gives me more svn trunk logs to check everyday for changes
19:04 < dooglus_> Headbang: there was a new release (0.61.08) yesterday, you see?
19:04 < Headbang> i just sttumpled across this project on freshmeat
19:04 < Headbang> which i started visiting since years ago
19:05 < Headbang> this week
19:05 < Headbang> my gf is a really nice drawer
19:05 < Headbang> and she always wants to publish a carrtoon
19:05 < Headbang> and ive got another reason for looking into it, i wanna make a pricelist which is gonna be displayed on a 19" widescreen tft
19:06 < Headbang> and was doubting between flash or something
19:06 < Headbang> to make it have funny things
19:06 < Headbang> but maybe i can do something with synfig
19:06 < dooglus_> yeah
19:06 < Headbang> and i dont like making something in flash
19:06 < Headbang> and then run it on linux on display
19:07 < Headbang> but im on a laggy wifi connection and dont really feel like installing all the windows dependencies
19:08 < dooglus_> I would suggest waiting until you can install on a linux machine
19:08 < dooglus_> synfig runs better on linux than on windows
19:08 < Headbang> this machine is dual boot but i got my own pc few days ago just dont have a monitor for it yet
19:08 < Headbang> k cool :)
19:09 < Headbang> should get included in ubuntu studio...
19:09 < dooglus_> it is already
19:09 < dooglus_> isn't it?
19:09 < Headbang> o ok :)
19:09 < Headbang> good :p
19:09 < dooglus_> not the new version though
19:10 < dooglus_> not yet, anyway
19:10 < Headbang> i would love to make a cartoon about my work
19:10 < Headbang> gheheh
19:10 < Headbang> would be a nuthouse :)
19:10 < Headbang> but im off for some shopping
19:11 < genete> Headbang: it is worth to make your own svn version for your machine. 
19:11 < genete> and under linux of course
19:11 < Headbang> you mean use svn as source?
19:11 < Headbang> i mostly do
19:11 < dooglus_> Yoyobuae: I looked at the code for the bline_tangent convert - it has a 0.5 factor coded in there for no good reason I can see
19:11 < genete> to build your own synfig using the build instructions
19:11 < Headbang> yeah i will
19:12 < Headbang> maybe if it stays dry
19:12 < Headbang> i can take the monitor on my bike :P
19:12 < genete> this project is (hopefully) under heavy development so bugs are killed as far as they appear ;)
19:12 < Headbang> neat :)
19:12 < genete> but still appearing :)
19:12 < Headbang> im busy staying close on svn on some projects atm
19:13 < Headbang> all having some major changes
19:13 < Headbang> always nice :)
19:13 < Headbang> but i think ill hang around a bit so see what i can do with synfig
19:13 < genete> dooglus_:  BTW, I've just send a new pair of bugs for you un the traker ;)
19:13 < Yoyobuae> dooglus_: so that's why tangents come out short =)
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19:17 < CIA-35> synfig: dooglus * r1852 / (ETL/trunk/NEWS synfig-core/trunk/NEWS): Fix indentation.
19:17 < CIA-35> synfig: dooglus * r1853 / (4 files in 3 dirs): Remove the ETL_FIXED_DERIVATIVE macro.
19:17 < CIA-35> synfig: dooglus * r1854 /synfig-core/trunk/src/synfig/valuenode_blinecalctangent.cpp: Use a bigger epsilon when calculating bline tangents. It gives a more accurate result, since it reduces the effect of rounding errors.
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19:29 < genete> Hi Headie 
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21:37 < factor> relo genete
21:37 < genete> hello (bis)
21:37 < genete> factor: have you ever buy something in ebay?
21:40 < factor> nope
21:41 < factor> was going to buyu the russian space shuttle , but finally opted against it.
21:42 < genete> lol
21:43 < factor> Rocket fuel being so high and all
21:48 < factor> genete: why going to buy something
21:49 < genete> it is a collection toy for my son
21:49 < genete> it comes from Italy
21:50 < genete> I should try it :)
21:50 < genete> (dinner time) ;)
21:50  * genete is away: Estoy ocupado
21:50 < factor> k
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--- Log closed Tue Mar 04 00:00:00 2008